2001

Peter Hall's Troilus & Cressida

The Shakespeare Conference: SHK 12.0865  Tuesday, 17 April 2001

From:           Larry Weiss <This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.>
Date:           Monday, 16 Apr 2001 15:56:08 -0400
Subject:        Peter Hall's Troilus & Cressida

Peter Hall's first Off-Broadway production is an in-the-round Troilus &
Cressida now running at the American Place Theater in New York.  Tony
Church is Pandarus.  The New York Times gave it a poor notice today.
Ignore him; the show is well worth seeing.

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Re: Shakespeare and Sullivan

The Shakespeare Conference: SHK 12.0864  Tuesday, 17 April 2001

From:           Mike Jensen <This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.>
Date:           Monday, 16 Apr 2001 15:08:18 -0700
Subject: Re: Shakespeare and Sullivan
Comment:        SHK 12.0848 Re: Shakespeare and Sullivan

Since Ann Carrigan mentioned the Museum of Television and Radio, I'll
add that I put in time at the New York location researching Shakespeare
on television, and was able to view four of several productions in their
catalog.  Once you get the hang of it, and that doesn't take long, it is
very easy to navigate.  I believe they have only American productions
from the late 40s through the 1970s for Shakespeare, but that could be
my bad memory.  The ballet in the Hallmark *Shrew* chilled my blood.
We've come a long way, baby.

The shows I viewed, amongst others in their holdings, are not
commercially available.  They were broadcast before any of us had VCRs,
so your friends probably don't have copies to lend you.  A visit to the
Museum is one of the few ways you can see these kinescopes.

All the best,
Mike Jensen

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Re: Bard Bade Goodbye

The Shakespeare Conference: SHK 12.0862  Tuesday, 17 April 2001

[1]     From:   Ian Munro <This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.>
        Date:   Monday, 16 Apr 2001 11:47:35 -0700
        Subj:   Re: SHK 12.0850 Re: Bard Bade Goodbye

[2]     From:   Larry Weiss <This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.>
        Date:   Monday, 16 Apr 2001 15:32:10 -0400
        Subj:   Re: SHK 12.0850 Re: Bard Bade Goodbye

[3]     From:   Hugh Grady <This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.>
        Date:   Monday, 16 Apr 2001 16:21:44 -0400
        Subj:   RE: SHK 12.0850 Re: Bard Bade Goodbye

[4]     From:   Karen Peterson-Kranz <This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.>
        Date:   Monday, 16 Apr 2001 20:30:38 -0700 (PDT)
        Subj:   Re: SHK 12.0850 Re: Bard Bade Goodbye


[1]-----------------------------------------------------------------
From:           Ian Munro <This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.>
Date:           Monday, 16 Apr 2001 11:47:35 -0700
Subject: 12.0850 Re: Bard Bade Goodbye
Comment:        Re: SHK 12.0850 Re: Bard Bade Goodbye

Syd Kasten wrote:

>As for the chemical metaphors "corrosive" and "pollution", read
>"Fashionable Nonsense, Postmodern Intellectuals' Abuse of Science" by
>Sokal and Bricmont, whose title speaks for itself.  Since we are dealing
>with culture I would prefer to use a biological metaphor such as
>"cross-pollination".

Life is too short to read any more Sokal, but if he thinks "pollution"
is a chemical metaphor he should buy a better dictionary.  As for
"corrosive," the figurative use of the term dates to 1581, which to my
mind makes it particularly apt for a discussion of Shakespeare.

Ian Munro

[2]-------------------------------------------------------------
From:           Larry Weiss <This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.>
Date:           Monday, 16 Apr 2001 15:32:10 -0400
Subject: 12.0850 Re: Bard Bade Goodbye
Comment:        Re: SHK 12.0850 Re: Bard Bade Goodbye

>The embattled French at times seem still to be fighting the Seven Years
>War.  I think it was the American baseball manager Casey Stengel who
>observed that it was "deja vu all over again"

That's generous.  I think they still haven't gotten over the Hundred
Years War.  And it was Yogi Berra, not Casey Stengel.

[3]-------------------------------------------------------------
From:           Hugh Grady <This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.>
Date:           Monday, 16 Apr 2001 16:21:44 -0400
Subject: 12.0850 Re: Bard Bade Goodbye
Comment:        RE: SHK 12.0850 Re: Bard Bade Goodbye

No, it was Yogi Berra.

Excellent getting to know you a bit in Miami.

Best wishes,
Hugh Grady

[4]-------------------------------------------------------------
From:           Karen Peterson-Kranz <This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.>
Date:           Monday, 16 Apr 2001 20:30:38 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: 12.0850 Re: Bard Bade Goodbye
Comment:        Re: SHK 12.0850 Re: Bard Bade Goodbye

Sean Lawrence wrote last week that

> >................................... Kurosawa was
> denounced by French
> >intellectuals (I don't know of what school) as "not
> Japanese enough".

Syd Kasten in turn denounced French and Quebecoise language policy, and
the cultural metaphor of "pollution."  To this I wanted to add a couple
of (I hope) clarifying points.  Perhaps they might even relate back to
early modern Europe, if not Shakespeare.

French intellectuals aren't the only people who saw Kurosawa as "not
Japanese."  Japanese intellectuals, and in fact, a pretty fair number of
ordinary Japanese movie-goers, had and have the same perception.

Similarly, the idea of "pollution" is not exclusively, or even
particularly, French.  It is, actually, an important concept in some
aspects of Japanese culture.  For example, Shinto, the Japanese
indigenous traditional spiritual practice, revolves NOT around ideas of
sin and redemption but rather around ideas of pollution and
purification.  This is why one must wash one's hands and rinse one's
mouth before visiting a Shinto shrine.  This is also why Sumo athletes
throw salt into the ring before a bout.

The pollution metaphor is not unique to Japan, of course.  It informs
much early modern medical theory, and also may be detected in the
discourse of the (threatened?) aristocracy in England.  And, most
notably, the pollution/purification motif seems to appear in many
nationalist ideologies.  The French and French Canadian manifestations
that Syd Kasten cited would be in this latter category, but the
manipulation of the idea of cultural pollution is certainly not just a
French notion.  The English were doing it very well indeed in
Shakespeare's time, and before.

For what it's worth.

Cheers,
Karen Peterson

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Re: Coleridge Explanation of Verse

The Shakespeare Conference: SHK 12.0863  Tuesday, 17 April 2001

From:           Peter Groves <This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.>
Date:           Tuesday, 17 Apr 2001 17:35:03 +1000
Subject: 12.0857 Re: Coleridge Explanation of Verse
Comment:        Re: SHK 12.0857 Re: Coleridge Explanation of Verse

> >Just a footnote to the Coleridge poem 'Metrical Feet': the version
> >recently quoted is incomplete. The full text, which I found in John
> >Lennard's excellent *The Poetry Handbook* (Oxford, 1996) --
> should be
> >recommended reading in all English departments -- is as follows:

Lennard's book may have many good points, but his discussion of metre
itself is not among them.  He remarks, for example, that "'rigidly'
would normally be pronounced as a dactyl, but I have scanned it as three
consecutive stresses, so that the line [from Walcott's "Nearing Forty"]
begins with two consecutive spondees: RIGID- | LY ME- |tred EAR-| ly RIS
| ing RAIN" (19)"; on the same page he scans the phrase "steadier
elation" as a sequence of six (!!) stressed syllables.  How this kind or
arbitrary nonsense can be supposed to help the students it is aimed at I
do not understand.

Peter Groves

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Re: Ariel's Gender

The Shakespeare Conference: SHK 12.0861  Tuesday, 17 April 2001

[1]     From:   Stuart Manger <This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.>
        Date:   Monday, 16 Apr 2001 17:59:48 +0100
        Subj:   SHK 12.0838 Re: Ariel's Gender

[2]     From:   David Lindley <This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.>
        Date:   Monday, 16 Apr 2001 18:11:05 +0100
        Subj:   Re: SHK 12.0838 Re: Ariel's Gender


[1]-----------------------------------------------------------------
From:           Stuart Manger <This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.>
Date:           Monday, 16 Apr 2001 17:59:48 +0100
Subject: Re: Ariel's Gender
Comment:        SHK 12.0838 Re: Ariel's Gender

Larry, 'Bird' does not necessarily connote girl. Lady Macduff calls her
boy 'poor bird'. Maybe it is an icon of freedom, youth, vulnerability,
un-tameability?

Stuart Manger

[2]-------------------------------------------------------------
From:           David Lindley <This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.>
Date:           Monday, 16 Apr 2001 18:11:05 +0100
Subject: 12.0838 Re: Ariel's Gender
Comment:        Re: SHK 12.0838 Re: Ariel's Gender

Gabriel Egan writes:

> Prospero tells Ariel to "Be subject / To no sight but thine and mine",
> which is so silly (as though he'd become invisible to himself) that we
> are justified in wondering if something's dropped out of the metrically
> defective passage. Stephen Orgel, editing the play for the Oxford
> Shakespeare, suggested that what has dropped out here are instructions
> about the spirits who sing "Come unto these yellow sands" and it they
> who must remain invisible to all but Ariel and Prospero.

I'm not persuaded of this.  Yes, considered logically, it's redundant,
even 'silly' - but the audience need to be told that Ariel is invisible,
and the costume he adopts is appropriate to his function here, as his
later costumings are to his various emblematic functions.  There is,
after all, no evidence that any other character than Prospero sees Ariel
in his 'own' shape - Miranda,  Ferdinand, Trinculo, Stephano and Caliban
all seem equally unaware of him.

I respect Stephen Orgel's edition enormously, but on this occasion beg
to differ.  The logical implication of his suggestion would be not
merely that the attendant spirits were invisible to Ferdinand, but,
conversely, that Ariel was.  Yet Ferdinand speaks only of disembodied
'music' creeping by him on the waters.

What I think IS silly is the effort in some productions to make Ariel
invisible to Prospero.  Gielgud claimed that he never looked at Ariel in
any performance, and Noble in 1998 tried (unsuccessfully to most of the
audience) to suggest that Prospero couldn't see Ariel at all.  This, to
my mind, makes nonsense of the relationship between Prospero and Ariel,
however one wants to construe it.

David Lindley

_______________________________________________________________
S H A K S P E R: The Global Shakespeare Discussion List
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