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Home :: Archive :: 2001 :: June ::
Re: Geography
The Shakespeare Conference: SHK 12.1506  Friday, 15 June 2001

[1]     From:   Karen Peterson-Kranz <
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        Date:   Thursday, 14 Jun 2001 07:25:24 -0700 (PDT)
        Subj:   Re: SHK 12.1491 Re: Geography

[2]     From:   Don Bloom <
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        Date:   Thursday, 14 Jun 2001 09:34:22 -0500
        Subj:   Re: SHK 12.1491 Re: Geography

[3]     From:   Stevie Gamble <
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        Date:   Thursday, 14 Jun 2001 11:08:44 EDT
        Subj:   Re: SHK 12.1491 Re: Geography

[4]     From:   R. A. Cantrell <
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        Date:   Thursday, 14 Jun 2001 14:44:30 -0500
        Subj:   Geography


[1]-----------------------------------------------------------------
From:           Karen Peterson-Kranz <
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Date:           Thursday, 14 Jun 2001 07:25:24 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: 12.1491 Re: Geography
Comment:        Re: SHK 12.1491 Re: Geography

> Let's get back to the point.  England is not and
> never has been an
> island.  Gaunt's 'mistake' confirms Shakespeare as a
> servant of ideology
> rather than a dealer in what some like to think of
> as the simple truth.

Is there a possibility that Gaunt's 'mistake' IS Gaunt's, rather than
Shakespeare's?  In other words, could Shakespeare have been representing
ideology here, rather than just reproducing it?

Of course, representing an ideological notion (e.g. England embraces and
may metonymically represent all of Britain) may serve the interests of
the state as well as uncritical reproduction of the same notion does.
One maxim of the public relations industry is that bad publicity is
better than no publicity.

Cheers,
Karen Peterson

[2]-------------------------------------------------------------
From:           Don Bloom <
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Date:           Thursday, 14 Jun 2001 09:34:22 -0500
Subject: 12.1491 Re: Geography
Comment:        Re: SHK 12.1491 Re: Geography

>England is not and never has been an
>island.  (TH)

Could have sworn my globe has it as an island, and just off the coast of
Nova Scotia, too.

Do you suppose that's what John Donne had in mind some years back when
he said, "No man is an island"? (Al Capp put it a little differently in
Li'l Abner when he wrote: "No man is a Ireland." That might get into too
much politics, though.)

Just curious,
don

[3]-------------------------------------------------------------
From:           Stevie Gamble <
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Date:           Thursday, 14 Jun 2001 11:08:44 EDT
Subject: 12.1491 Re: Geography
Comment:        Re: SHK 12.1491 Re: Geography

>Let's get back to the point.  England is not and never has been an
>island.  Gaunt's 'mistake' confirms Shakespeare as a servant of ideology
>rather than a dealer in what some like to think of as the simple truth.

It's perfectly possible that Shakespeare doesn't fit either of those
options; do the words 'excluded middle' ring any bells? Geographically
or otherwise?

Best wishes,
Stevie Gamble

[4]-------------------------------------------------------------
From:           R. A. Cantrell <
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Date:           Thursday, 14 Jun 2001 14:44:30 -0500
Subject:        Geography

> Let's get back to the point.

Exactly.  I am glad that you wish to do so. I was somewhat taken aback
when you diverted my inquiry into textual sources from the period toward
your own political ideology.

> England is not and never has been an
> island.  Gaunt's 'mistake' confirms Shakespeare as a servant of ideology
> rather than a dealer in what some like to think of as the simple truth.

No one could have taken Gaunt to mean such, and his only mistake was
speaking before an ideologically obsessed audience that would not hear
simple metaphor.

> Heaven knows why that should surprise anybody. Yet, in their efforts to
> protect him from a role he readily adopts, the Bard's sentimental
> worshippers seem prepared to engage in astonishing intellectual
> contortions to persuade us that 'isle' here mysteriously means
> 'peninsula'.  Why?

The only reason that they are talking about islands or peninsulas rather
that texts is your deft diversion.

> I sometimes think that Chicken-Licken is alive and
> well and living in Canada.

All sorts of critters live in Canada, I've even got relatives there.

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