Make a Donation

Consider making a donation to support SHAKSPER.

Subscribe to Our Feeds

Current Postings RSS

Announcements RSS

Home :: Archive :: 2002 :: April ::
Re: Towards a New Dunciad
The Shakespeare Conference: SHK 13.0965  Monday, 8 April 2002

[1]     From:   Scott Oldenburg <
 This e-mail address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it
 >
        Date:   Friday, 05 Apr 2002 11:03:36 -0800
        Subj:   Re: SHK 13.0961 Re: Towards a New Dunciad

[2]     From:   Martin Steward <
 This e-mail address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it
 >
        Date:   Friday, 5 Apr 2002 17:19:04 +0100
        Subj:   Re: SHK 13.0961 Re: Towards a New Dunciad

[3]     From:   William Proctor Williams <
 This e-mail address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it
 >
        Date:   Friday, 05 Apr 2002 11:24:13 -0500
        Subj:   Re: SHK 13.0961 Re: Towards a New Dunciad

[4]     From:   R.A. Cantrell <
 This e-mail address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it
 >
        Date:   Friday, 05 Apr 2002 13:13:13 -0600
        Subj:   Re: SHK 13.0961 Re: Towards a New Dunciad

[5]     From:   Arthur Lindley <
 This e-mail address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it
 >
        Date:   Saturday, 6 Apr 2002 09:31:16 +0800 (SGT)
        Subj:   Re: SHK 13.0961 Re: Towards a New Dunciad

[6]     From:   David Wallace <
 This e-mail address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it
 >
        Date:   Saturday, 06 Apr 2002 00:31:09 -0800
        Subj:   Re: SHK 13.0961 Re: Towards a New Dunciad

[7]     From:   Martin Steward <
 This e-mail address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it
 >
        Date:   Saturday, 6 Apr 2002 18:15:56 +0100
        Subj:   "Proteus" & SHAXICON


[1]-----------------------------------------------------------------
From:           Scott Oldenburg <
 This e-mail address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it
 >
Date:           Friday, 05 Apr 2002 11:03:36 -0800
Subject: 13.0961 Re: Towards a New Dunciad
Comment:        Re: SHK 13.0961 Re: Towards a New Dunciad

Unless I've missed something (entirely possible in my rapid fire
deletions), we are avoiding a central question:  What exactly is the
function of criticism?  How one answers this question necessarily shapes
whether Shakespeare on film is worthy of attention or not.

Best,
Scott

[2]-------------------------------------------------------------
From:           Martin Steward <
 This e-mail address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it
 >
Date:           Friday, 5 Apr 2002 17:19:04 +0100
Subject: 13.0961 Re: Towards a New Dunciad
Comment:        Re: SHK 13.0961 Re: Towards a New Dunciad

The Terry Hawkes theory is an interesting one. So what - is the clue in
the email address? "Proteus"? Is that a date of birth, 6th August 1947?

The trouble is that right now Prof. Hawkes is composing a post that
begins, "I can assure Mr. Holland that I do exist, and that I go legally
by the name Charles Weinstein..."

How ever can we know...?

m

[3]-------------------------------------------------------------
From:           William Proctor Williams <
 This e-mail address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it
 >
Date:           Friday, 05 Apr 2002 11:24:13 -0500
Subject: 13.0961 Re: Towards a New Dunciad
Comment:        Re: SHK 13.0961 Re: Towards a New Dunciad

Many thanks to Peter Holland for solving the puzzle.  I knew there was
something very similar about Charles Weinstein and Terry Hawkes which
caused many, far too many, to always rise to the bait, no matter how
unlikely that bait might be.  It has been a terrific job of
impersonation but I am glad that now we all know.  However, a doubt
still lingers: could it be Weinstein who is pretending to be Hawkes?

William Proctor Williams

[4]-------------------------------------------------------------
From:           R.A. Cantrell <
 This e-mail address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it
 >
Date:           Friday, 05 Apr 2002 13:13:13 -0600
Subject: 13.0961 Re: Towards a New Dunciad
Comment:        Re: SHK 13.0961 Re: Towards a New Dunciad

> The above exchange is extremely dispiriting. Yes it is. No it isn't.
> Yes it is. It sounds like a couple of kids squabbling. It is not
> academic discussion and it shows more signs of the onset of Universal
> Darkness than any Shakespeare film.

 No it doesn't.

Yark yark yark, but it is an example of the inane chatter that Professor
Weinstein remarks.

All the best,
R.A. Cantrell
<
 This e-mail address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it
 >

[5]-------------------------------------------------------------
From:           Arthur Lindley <
 This e-mail address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it
 >
Date:           Saturday, 6 Apr 2002 09:31:16 +0800 (SGT)
Subject: 13.0961 Re: Towards a New Dunciad
Comment:        Re: SHK 13.0961 Re: Towards a New Dunciad

> I'm sorry to have been so gullible for so long. It took me till today to
> realise that Charles Weinstein is really Terry Hawkes playing another
> brilliant joke on us all.

I'd been thinking he was the reincarnation of Queenie Leavis, as devoted
as ever to the belief that seriousness is measured by the number of
things one despises.  Peter's explanation has the advantage of not
requiring an act of faith, however, so I'll adopt it.

Arthur Lindley

[6]-------------------------------------------------------------
From:           David Wallace <
 This e-mail address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it
 >
Date:           Saturday, 06 Apr 2002 00:31:09 -0800
Subject: 13.0961 Re: Towards a New Dunciad
Comment:        Re: SHK 13.0961 Re: Towards a New Dunciad

In the context of a larger argument I remarked:

>Shakespeare's Comedy of Errors is not a masterpiece.

To which R.A. Cantrell responded (somewhat cryptically):

>Yes it is.

To which P.D. Holland scolded:

> The above exchange is extremely dispiriting. Yes it is. No it isn't.
> Yes it is. It sounds like a couple of kids squabbling. It is not
> academic discussion and it shows more signs of the onset of Universal
> Darkness than any Shakespeare film.

Oh please! There was no squabbling involved at all. I could not tell
whether R.A. Cantrell's comment was meant to be playful or provocative -
so I ignored it. To be described as one of a "couple of kid's
squabbling" is insulting. To suggest that this exchange is somehow
contributing to "the onset of Universal Darkness" bespeaks a rather
perverse lack of perspective.

P.D. Holland continues:

> OED, incidentally, helpfully reminds us that the word 'masterpiece'
> probably derives from Dutch and German words used for the work achieved
> by a craftsman to make the transition to the status of a master. It's a
> useful idea and, on that basis if no other, would mean that *Errors* is
> unquestionably a masterpiece.

Okay, I get it. Shakespeare is a "master", ERRORS is one of his
"pieces"; therefore, ERRORS is a masterpiece. If Shakespeare had been
inspired by one of his grocery lists, would that constitute a
masterpiece? ERRORS has plenty to commend it. I don't consider it
heresy, however, to suggest that it does not provide the same range and
intensity of aesthetic satisfactions that many of the mature comedies
offer.

Regards,
David Wallace

[7]-------------------------------------------------------------
From:           Martin Steward <
 This e-mail address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it
 >
Date:           Saturday, 6 Apr 2002 18:15:56 +0100
Subject:        "Proteus" & SHAXICON

Having subjected all of the contributions attributed to "Charles
Weinstein" and "Terrence Hawkes" to the scrutiny of SHAXICON, the
computer software is 98% certain that the author[s] do not exist.

It detects a 2% probability that all of the contributions were composed
by somebody called "Edward de Vere, 17th Earl of Oxford".

m

_______________________________________________________________
S H A K S P E R: The Global Shakespeare Discussion List
Hardy M. Cook, 
 This e-mail address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it
 
The S H A K S P E R Web Site <http://www.shaksper.net>

DISCLAIMER: Although SHAKSPER is a moderated discussion list, the
opinions expressed on it are the sole property of the poster, and the
editor assumes no responsibility for them.
 

©2011 Hardy Cook. All rights reserved.