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Home :: Archive :: 2003 :: March ::
Re: Questions
The Shakespeare Conference: SHK 14.0422  Thursday, 6 March 2003

[1]     From:   David Lindley <
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        Date:   Friday, 28 Feb 2003 15:43:13 GMT0BST
        Subj:   Re: SHK 14.0409 Re: Questions

[2]     From:   Phyllis Rackin <
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        Date:   Friday, 28 Feb 2003 10:49:57 -0500 (EST)
        Subj:   Re: SHK 14.0409 Re: Questions

[3]     From:   Martin Steward <
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        Date:   Friday,28 Feb 2003 15:06:09 -0000
        Subj:   SH4.0409 Re: Questions

[4]     From:   Markus Marti <
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        Date:   Friday, 28 Feb 2003 18:33:24 +0100
        Subj:   Re: SHK 14.0409 Re: Questions

[5]     From:   James Conlan <
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        Date:   Saturday, 01 Mar 2003 15:46:44 +0000
        Subj:   Re: SHK 14.0409 Re: Questions


[1]-----------------------------------------------------------------
From:           David Lindley <
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Date:           Friday, 28 Feb 2003 15:43:13 GMT0BST
Subject: 14.0409 Re: Questions
Comment:        Re: SHK 14.0409 Re: Questions

The hotel in which I am hoping to spend a few days in Verona later this
year is Hotel Gulietta e Romeo.  Perhaps its owners read only the last
line of the play?  Or do the Italians see it differently?

David Lindley

[2]-------------------------------------------------------------
From:           Phyllis Rackin <
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Date:           Friday, 28 Feb 2003 10:49:57 -0500 (EST)
Subject: 14.0409 Re: Questions
Comment:        Re: SHK 14.0409 Re: Questions

How about "forget" or "yet," or, still better, "Capulet"?  Admittedly,
they'd all require some changes in wording, but the couplet as it stands
ain't that great anyway.

Phyllis Rackin

[3]-------------------------------------------------------------
From:           Martin Steward <
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Date:           Friday, 28 Feb 2003 15:06:09 -0000
Subject: Re: Questions
Comment:        SHK 14.0409 Re: Questions

'I spent a happy few minutes thinking of rhymes for "-et." I couldn't
find anything that either substituted adequately for "woe," or provided
the ribaldry necessary for a satisfactory parody. Any suggestions?'

We've never heard a worser story yet,
Than that of Romeo and his Juliet
(The poison plot, however, is quite wet).

Finis

M

[4]-------------------------------------------------------------
From:           Markus Marti <
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Date:           Friday, 28 Feb 2003 18:33:24 +0100
Subject: 14.0409 Re: Questions
Comment:        Re: SHK 14.0409 Re: Questions

>I spent a happy few minutes thinking of rhymes for "-et." I couldn't
>find anything that either substituted adequately for "woe," or provided
>the ribaldry necessary for a satisfactory parody. Any suggestions?

It seems that Shakespeare could not make up his mind:

Q 5 has:

For never was a fate we more regret
Than this of Romeo and his Juliet.

The early Octavo edition O 1 (1591) had:

No other pair as sad an end did get
As dear old Romeo and Juliet.

And even O 2, which is otherwise just a reprint of O 1, differs in the
last two lines:

Is there a story that us more upsets
than gentle Romeo's and Juliet's?

Markus Marti

--
New on our webpage [http://www.unibas.ch/shine/]:
British History and Culture (cultural links related to Shakespeare and
to our course on the essay from 1600-1900)
[http://www.unibas.ch/shine/brithist/index.htm]

Translators of Shakespeare: [http://www.unibas.ch/shine/translators.htm]
Early English editors of Shakespeare:
[http://www.unibas.ch/shine/linksearlyeditors.htm]

Spass mit Shakespeare: http://www.unibas.ch/shine/williamsbirne.htm

Markus Marti

[5]-------------------------------------------------------------
From:           James Conlan <
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Date:           Saturday, 01 Mar 2003 15:46:44 +0000
Subject: 14.0409 Re: Questions
Comment:        Re: SHK 14.0409 Re: Questions

Dear colleagues:

Don Bloom queried,

"I spent a happy few minutes thinking of rhymes for "-et." I couldn't
find anything that either substituted adequately for "woe," or provided
the ribaldry necessary for a satisfactory parody. Any suggestions?"

As long as we are entertaining options, I'd point out that the final
couplet of _R&J_ is the Prince's

"For never was a story of more woe
Than this of Juliet and her Romeo" (Riverside first edition, 5.3.309-10)

Almost the same sense with a different order could be conveyed by the
couplet,

"For never was a tale of more regret
Than this of Romeo and his Juliet."

As Shakespeare rhymes Juliet with "be set" in Montague's final couplet:

"There shall no figure at such rate be set
As that of true and faithful Juliet."(5.3.301-2)

the Prince could have used almost the same rhyme to express empathy with
the parents:

Ne'er was there a couple more beset /
Than they, your Romeo and your Juliet."

But the prince does not.  As the prince concludes the play, Juliet has
greater status than "her Romeo" in their marriage.  Shakespeare's need
to conclude on a rhyming couplet should not keep us from recognizing
that the prince has established an order of precedence contrary to the
rules of civil law marriage in which the wife enters into the hand of
her husband.  In making this pronouncement, the Prince implies that the
Capulets are of far greater status than the Montagues, a finding that is
unlikely to bring about peace.

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