2003

Queen Elizabeth I National Maritime Museum Exhibition

The Shakespeare Conference: SHK 14.1251  Monday, 23 June 2003

From:           Richard Burt <This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.>
Date:           Friday, 20 Jun 2003 09:47:13 -0400
Subject:        Queen Elizabeth I National Maritime Museum Exhibition

The official website is

http://www.nmm.ac.uk/site/request/setTemplate:singlecontent/contentTypeA/conWebDoc/contentId/6083/navId/005001000001004007

Lots of info.

_______________________________________________________________
S H A K S P E R: The Global Shakespeare Discussion List
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DISCLAIMER: Although SHAKSPER is a moderated discussion list, the
opinions expressed on it are the sole property of the poster, and the
editor assumes no responsibility for them.

Re: Wriothesley

The Shakespeare Conference: SHK 14.1250  Monday, 23 June 2003

[1]     From:   Richard Kennedy <This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.>
        Date:   Friday, 20 Jun 2003 07:55:31 -0700
        Subj:   Re: SHK 14.1227 Re: Wriothesley

[2]     From:   Michael Egan <This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.>
        Date:   Friday, 20 Jun 2003 05:57:29 -1000
        Subj:   Re: SHK 14.1227 Re: Wriothesley

[3]     From:   Rainbow Saari <This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.>
        Date:   Saturday, 21 Jun 2003 10:20:42 +1200
        Subj:   Wriothesley


[1]-----------------------------------------------------------------
From:           Richard Kennedy <This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.>
Date:           Friday, 20 Jun 2003 07:55:31 -0700
Subject: 14.1227 Re: Wriothesley
Comment:        Re: SHK 14.1227 Re: Wriothesley

The DNB has this to say of Henry Wriothesley's great-grandfather, Sir
Thomas (d. 1534):

"He spelt his name in a variety of ways, originally as Writh or Wrythe,
subsequently as Wreseley, Writhesley, and eventually Wriothesley; the
last was the form adopted by his own and his brother's family.  In Tudor
times it was pronounced Wrisley."

STC19867 led me to an item that might settle the matter, not just to
take the word of the DNB.  It is an epitaph of some 110 lines upon the
death of Henry's father, Lord Henry the 2nd Earl of Southampton.  Within
a decorated border, the poem in black letter, the Earl is honored under
this heading:

"An Epitaph on the death, of the Right honorable and vertuous Lord Henry
WRISLEY, the Noble Earle of Southhampton: who lieth interred at
Touchfeelde in the Countie of Hamshyre, the 30. day of November 1581.
and in the 24. yeare of our most drad and Soveraigne Ladie Elizabeth by
the grace of God, of England, Fraunce, & Ireland Queen. &c."

And so, WRIOTHESLEY seems to be spoken as WRISLEY, if we can take the
above as a phonetic proof.  And so the ROSE of the marriage Sonnets
cannot be a pun on WRIOTHESLEY.

[2]-------------------------------------------------------------
From:           Michael Egan <This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.>
Date:           Friday, 20 Jun 2003 05:57:29 -1000
Subject: 14.1227 Re: Wriothesley
Comment:        Re: SHK 14.1227 Re: Wriothesley

Giroux, The Book Known as Q, suggests Rizley, but Rosely gives a whole
new resonance to the rose imagery in the sonnets, supporting the thesis
that Mr HW was Mr WH.

--Michael Egan

[3]-------------------------------------------------------------
From:           Rainbow Saari <This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.>
Date:           Saturday, 21 Jun 2003 10:20:42 +1200
Subject:        Wriothesley

Bill Bryson, author of *Mother Tongue* ( Penguin, London 1991) offers
these pronunciations of Wriothesley; 'rottsly', 'rittsly', 'rizzli',
'rithly' and 'wriotheslee'.

I am persuaded by Martin Green's  arguments in his * Wriothesley's
Roses* that Shakespeare pronounced the name 'rosely'.

Cheers all,
Rainbow Saari

_______________________________________________________________
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Non-Shakespearian Drama Database and SHAXICAN

The Shakespeare Conference: SHK 14.1248  Monday, 23 June 2003

From:           Gabriel Egan <This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.>
Date:           Monday, 23 Jun 2003 10:54:31 +0100
Subject:        Non-Shakespearian Drama Database and SHAXICAN

SHAKSPERians might be interested to know to that the non-Shakespearian
Drama Database (NSDD) and SHAXICAN are moving, and that the former has
recently been updated to include links to the full texts of each of its
710 plays.

The website at www.totus.org that was hosting these resources will
shortly close and NSDD and SHAXICAN will instead be hosted at
www.GabrielEgan.com

NSDD provides an online replacement for Harbage's _Annals of English
Drama_ for the extant plays first performed between 1567 (when the first
purpose-built theatre opened) and 1642 (when the playhouses were
closed). The database names the playwright, year, playing company, and
genre for each play, and the entire listing can be re-sorted to put the
plays in alphabetic order on any of these fields (so, for example, all
the comedies together, or all the Admiral's men's plays together). Also,
the database now provides a direct link to the full text of each play in
Chadwyck-Healey's Literature Online (LION) database.  For this last
feature to work the user must be either i) looking at NSDD from within a
domain registered as a subscriber to LION, or ii) in possession of a
personal account to use LION (for example as provided by ATHENS).

Gabriel Egan

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Re: Edmund

The Shakespeare Conference: SHK 14.1249  Monday, 23 June 2003

[1]     From:   Edmund Taft <This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.>
        Date:   Friday, 20 Jun 2003 09:46:54 -0400
        Subj:   Edmund

[2]     From:   Alberto Cacicedo <This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.>
        Date:   Friday, 20 Jun 2003 12:14:56 -0400
        Subj:   Re: SHK 14.1233 Re: Edmund

[3]     From:   Tom Pendleton <This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.>
        Date:   Friday, 20 Jun 2003 21:11:02 -0400
        Subj:   RE: SHK 14.1233 Re: Edmund


[1]-----------------------------------------------------------------
From:           Edmund Taft <This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.>
Date:           Friday, 20 Jun 2003 09:46:54 -0400
Subject:        Edmund

Doug Eskew writes:

"Once Gloucester has dispossessed Edgar, he has lost the bond between
father and son. Faced with this lack, the 'whoreson' turns out to be
enough of a son to fulfill this need."

Right!  Gloucester and Lear live on the level of conventions. Neither
really knows the true meaning of love as the play opens. Lear
understands only one emotion: gratitude. Everybody should be infinitely
grateful to him for whatever he does. Gloucester, it seems to me, tells
Kent that he loves both of his sons equally only because it sounds good.
Both old men are selfish in their orientation. Both need to be judged by
their actions, not their words.  Isn't a central point of the opening
scene that words can be empty?

A lot of critics have focused on how awful the younger generation is in
_King Lear_. The older generation is pretty awful too.

--Ed Taft

[2]-------------------------------------------------------------
From:           Alberto Cacicedo <This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.>
Date:           Friday, 20 Jun 2003 12:14:56 -0400
Subject: 14.1233 Re: Edmund
Comment:        Re: SHK 14.1233 Re: Edmund

In response to Carol Barton's idea that Gloucester is teasing Edmund at
the beginning of Lear, I don't think that Edmund himself, at any rate,
sees daddy's behavior as "affectionate teasing." It's clear that Edmund
is meeting Kent for the first time, for instance, and it's only
relatively less clear that Edmund is embarrassed by what his father is
saying about him, about his mother, and about his illegitimacy
(something made absolutely evident in the opening soliloquy of 1.2).
Kent seems equally embarrassed by it all, and attempts to pass off
Gloucester's boorishness as politely as possible. Again only relatively
less clear is Gloucester's own discomfort with his bastard son. For me,
the locker room language with which Gloucester describes Edmund's
"getting" is "manly" bluster, which rather emphasizes the unease
Gloucester feels at having his son present at court --hence off he'll
send Edmund as soon as he can. And yes, no doubt, once Gloucester is
convinced that Edgar is a bastard (in the sense that Lear calls the
legitimate Goneril a "degenerate bastard") he turns his attention to
Edmund. As an index of how much affection goes with that turning, I find
the dialog at 2.1.37ff interesting, however: Gloucester enters in search
of Edgar, ignores Edmund's self-inflicted wound, insists on discovering
Edgar, and so forces Edmund to call attention to his own wound. How the
scene might be played is up to a director, of course, but there is
nothing in the language of the scene that indicates Gloucester's noting
Edmund's wound until finally he mentions it at 2.1.107-108. My
directorial choice would be to have Gloucester continue to ignore
Edmund's wound as he seeks for Edgar. To my mind, it all leads to the
pathetic "Yet Edmund was belov'd" in the final scene of the play.

In the midst of wind, rain, thunder, lightning,
Alberto Cacicedo
Albright College

[3]-------------------------------------------------------------
From:           Tom Pendleton <This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.>
Date:           Friday, 20 Jun 2003 21:11:02 -0400
Subject: 14.1233 Re: Edmund
Comment:        RE: SHK 14.1233 Re: Edmund

A couple of Edmund and France things:

At the beginning of the play Gloucester tells us that he loves his
illegitimate son, Edmund, as much as he loves his legitimate son, Edgar
(1.1.19-20), and at the opening of Act 1, scene 2, Edmund, and in
soliloquy, tells us the same thing (1.2.17-18).  It would seem that
Shakespeare wanted us to accept that Edmund was "beloved" by his father,
and I don't think that whatever shortcomings in Gloucester's manner of
loving his son we may claim cancels out this fact.

As for Lear's being eighty, the evidence is his own saying he's
"Fourscore and upward, not an hour more or less" (4.7.60).  He is of
course "old," but the combination of approximation and exactitude
shouldn't be treated as equivalently reliable as Iago's having looked on
the world for four times seven years.

Tom Pendleton

_______________________________________________________________
S H A K S P E R: The Global Shakespeare Discussion List
Hardy M. Cook, This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.
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DISCLAIMER: Although SHAKSPER is a moderated discussion list, the
opinions expressed on it are the sole property of the poster, and the
editor assumes no responsibility for them.

Re: SHAKSPER Posts of Late

The Shakespeare Conference: SHK 14.1247  Monday, 23 June 2003

From:           R. A. Cantrell <This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.>
Date:           Friday, 20 Jun 2003 08:41:20 -0500
Subject: 14.1242 Re: SHAKSPER Posts of Late
Comment:        Re: SHK 14.1242 Re: SHAKSPER Posts of Late

>Even Terence Hawkes has been
>coaxed or provoked into 5- or 6-sentence eructations.

Which I have very much enjoyed. Professor Hawkes's grace, wit, and style
are exemplary.

All the best,
R.A. Cantrell
<This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.>

_______________________________________________________________
S H A K S P E R: The Global Shakespeare Discussion List
Hardy M. Cook, This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.
The S H A K S P E R Web Site <http://www.shaksper.net>

DISCLAIMER: Although SHAKSPER is a moderated discussion list, the
opinions expressed on it are the sole property of the poster, and the
editor assumes no responsibility for them.

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