2004

Hamlet in Other Plays?

The Shakespeare Conference: SHK 15.1117  Tuesday, 25 May 2004

[1]     From:   Bonnie Melchior <This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.>
        Date:   Monday, 24 May 2004 12:21:37 -0500
        Subj:   Re: SHK 15.1104 Hamlet in Other Plays?

[2]     From:   M Yawney <This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.>
        Date:   Monday, 24 May 2004 08:00:12 -0700 (PDT)
        Subj:   Re: SHK 15.1104 Hamlet in Other Plays?

[3]     From:   Arthur Lindley <This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.>
        Date:   Tuesday, 25 May 2004 09:34:44 +0800
        Subj:   RE: SHK 15.1104 Hamlet in Other Plays?


[1]-----------------------------------------------------------------
From:           Bonnie Melchior <This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.>
Date:           Monday, 24 May 2004 12:21:37 -0500
Subject: 15.1104 Hamlet in Other Plays?
Comment:        Re: SHK 15.1104 Hamlet in Other Plays?

"In the Bleak Midwinter" (dir. Branagh, 1995) concerns an effort to save
a church (I think) by putting on a production of *Hamlet.*

[2]-------------------------------------------------------------
From:           M Yawney <This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.>
Date:           Monday, 24 May 2004 08:00:12 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: 15.1104 Hamlet in Other Plays?
Comment:        Re: SHK 15.1104 Hamlet in Other Plays?

No one has mentioned two classic "Hamlets"

1. W.S. Gilberts play Rosencrantz and Guilderstern

2. Tom Stopard's play Dogg's Hamlet, which features increasingly fast
speed retellings of the original Hamlet's plot.

Reference was made to Mabou Mines' Queen Lear. The title was actually
just Lear. It was Shakespeare's text with changes of gender rather than
wholesale adaptation. One line I remember gives the sense of what was
done: His voice was ever gentle, low; an excellent thing in a young man.

[3]-------------------------------------------------------------
From:           Arthur Lindley <This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.>
Date:           Tuesday, 25 May 2004 09:34:44 +0800
Subject: 15.1104 Hamlet in Other Plays?
Comment:        RE: SHK 15.1104 Hamlet in Other Plays?

Perhaps I missed a posting, but has anyone mentioned Tom Stoppard,
_Dogg's Hamlet, Cahoot's Macbeth_?

Arthur Lindley

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Greene's Upstart Crow

The Shakespeare Conference: SHK 15.1116  Tuesday, 25 May 2004

[1]     From:   Lisa Hopkins <This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.>
        Date:   Monday, 24 May 2004 16:05:11 +0100
        Subj:   Upstart crow

[2]     From:   Larry Weiss <This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.>
        Date:   Monday, 24 May 2004 18:32:11 -0400
        Subj:   Re: SHK 15.1106 Greene's Upstart Crow


[1]-----------------------------------------------------------------
From:           Lisa Hopkins <This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.>
Date:           Monday, 24 May 2004 16:05:11 +0100
Subject:        Upstart crow

In response to Dave Kathman's message, could I make it perfectly clear
that I was not endorsing the Wraight / Stern book, just responding to a
request for information about sources for the theory in question.  I did
consider adding a health warning about the book, but decided that an
intelligent reader would be perfectly capable of judging the quality of
the argument for him/herself.

Lisa Hopkins

[2]-------------------------------------------------------------
From:           Larry Weiss <This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.>
Date:           Monday, 24 May 2004 18:32:11 -0400
Subject: 15.1106 Greene's Upstart Crow
Comment:        Re: SHK 15.1106 Greene's Upstart Crow

 >"Beautified" with our feathers?  That's a vile phrase.

Wow!  I will never again read or hear those lines of Polonius's without
thinking that it is a deliberate inside joke taking a slap at Greene (or
whoever wrote "Groats-worth").  But WS used "beautified" once before in
TGV,IV.i.53 (... seeing you are beautified/ With goodly shape ...).

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Films

The Shakespeare Conference: SHK 15.1114  Tuesday, 25 May 2004

From:           Tanya Gough <This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.>
Date:           Monday, 24 May 2004 09:45:15 -0400
Subject: 15.1103 Films
Comment:        Re: SHK 15.1103 Films

 >Assuming the Troilus film is produced and there's no overlap of actors
 >between the two, who should be cast?  Maybe Michelle Pfeiffer as
 >Cressida.

I'm not sure why anyone would cast Pfeiffer in anything even remotely
Shakespearean, since she's on record in several interviews admitting
that she accepted the role of Titania in the Hoffman Midsummer Night's
Dream without knowing much at all about Shakespeare.  She also says she
quickly discovered she was in way over her head, understanding neither
the language nor the character.  Personally, I find her language stilted
and unnatural, and if you watch it again, you will see she looks
terribly uncomfortable and stiff.

I do admire her candor for admitting she was out of her league.  That's
not an easy thing to do.  But I also can't imagine how any amount of
training and coaching could help her gain enough natural fluidity of
language and comportment to carry a major Shakespearean role.

Also, isn't Pfeiffer a tad old to pull off Cressida?

Be that as it may, here's to the Troilus film and the hope that it might
come to pass.

Tanya Gough
The Poor Yorick Shakespeare Catalogue
www.bardcentral.com

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Touchstone and the Gods

The Shakespeare Conference: SHK 15.1115  Tuesday, 25 May 2004

From:           Chris Whatmore <This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.>
Date:           Tuesday, 25 May 2004 11:50:17 +0100
Subject: 15.1099 Touchstone and the Gods
Comment:        Re: SHK 15.1099 Touchstone and the Gods

Don Bloom wonders whether WS (or perhaps others connected with the
performance or publication of his plays) might, as an exercise in
self-censorship, have revised certain passages in AYLI and 12N by
substituting 'God' with references to pagan deities. He points in
particular to Touchstone's use of 'the gods' while seducing Audrey and
Malvolio's use of 'Jove' in his soliloquies, suggesting that the use of
God's name in these circumstances might have caused serious offence even
before such profanities were officially banned.

While nothing in the text necessarily contradicts this suggestion, there
is something about it that doesn't feel very Shakespearean. For one
thing, the juxtaposition of 'God' with overtly sexual references,
although rare, is not unknown elsewhere in the canon. In The Comedy of
Errors, for example, we have Dromio of Syracuse berating the Courtesan
with "And thereof comes that the wenches say 'God damn me' - that's as
much to say, 'God make me a light wench'..." which doesn't seem that
much different from Touchstone praising God/the gods for Audrey's
"foulness" and wishing that "sluttishness may come hereafter".

But on a more general level, it just seems more likely that WS would
have chosen to use 'God' or 'gods' for dramatic rather than purely
legal/religious reasons (before 1606, anyway). In the case of AYLI, one
could for example suggest that the characters' use of 'God' or 'gods' is
simply a tool to help define their identities as citizens of either the
quasi-mythological Forest or the more 'mainstream' (Christian) court.
The exiles therefore use 'God' because even though they happen to be
physically displaced, 'God' defines their spiritual provenance. Audrey
(and Phebe, in her letter), in referring to the pagan gods, identify
themselves fully as creatures of the forest. Touchstone, being the
chameleon that he is, uses both depending on who he is talking to. And
William, in choosing 'God', identifies himself as something else again -
a contemporary rustic from the Warwickshire Forest of Arden, much in the
same way as the Mechanicals' anachronistic use of 'God' in A Midsummer
Nights Dream marks them out from their pagan compatriots.

In the case of Malvolio, I would guess a similar case could be made -
although I'm less certain as to what it might be! Certainly, it could be
argued that his invocation of Jove and the stars betrays a lapse into an
atavistic, superstitious, pre-Christian value system that would be
familiar to anyone who has believed (even for a second) what they read
in their horoscope. When contrasted with his outward persona as a
'puritan', this 'pagan' sensibility would underline the hypocrisy of the
man and would give Sir Toby and the others ample basis for their taunts
of possession by the devil. Perhaps there were other reasons why WS
would wish to portray a Puritan as a closet pagan - I don't know enough
about the theology to judge that. All I'm suggesting is that the reasons
WS would have chosen one word over another are more likely to be
dramatically motivated than simply a matter of self-censorship.

chris

_______________________________________________________________
S H A K S P E R: The Global Shakespeare Discussion List
Hardy M. Cook, This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.
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DISCLAIMER: Although SHAKSPER is a moderated discussion list, the
opinions expressed on it are the sole property of the poster, and the
editor assumes no responsibility for them.

Urgent: Protest Shakespearean Under Fire

The Shakespeare Conference: SHK 15.1113  Tuesday, 25 May 2004

From:           Peter Bridgman <This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.>
Date:           Monday, 24 May 2004 13:25:24 +0100
Subject: 15.1102 Urgent: Protest Shakespearean Under Fire
Comment:        Re: SHK 15.1102 Urgent: Protest Shakespearean Under Fire

 >What did he do?

He upset the regime by putting on productions in both Hebrew and Arabic.

Peter Bridgman

_______________________________________________________________
S H A K S P E R: The Global Shakespeare Discussion List
Hardy M. Cook, This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.
The S H A K S P E R Web Site <http://www.shaksper.net>

DISCLAIMER: Although SHAKSPER is a moderated discussion list, the
opinions expressed on it are the sole property of the poster, and the
editor assumes no responsibility for them.

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