2005

Sonnets Question

The Shakespeare Conference: SHK 16.0232  Friday, 4 February 2005

From:           Dan Decker <This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.>
Date:           Thursday, 3 Feb 2005 12:48:37 EST
Subject:        Sonnets Question

Ok, so I read the sonnets. I saw lots that talk about Shakespeare's
physical, sexual needs, desires and hookups with a woman or women
unnamed. In them, the poet speaks clearly and unambiguously on the
subject of his sexual designs. I did not see any sonnets that talked
about the same sort of physical, sexual thing with any man or men. Can
someone point out to me the sonnet(s) I missed?

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Duke Ellington

The Shakespeare Conference: SHK 16.0231  Friday, 4 February 2005

From:           Randall Martin <This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.>
Date:           Friday, 04 Feb 2005 12:25:08 -0400
Subject: 16.0207 Duke Ellington
Comment:        Re: SHK 16.0207 Duke Ellington

List members might be interested in knowing that there is another CD
entitled Duke Ellington Live from the 1956 Stratford Festival, available
on Music and Arts Programs of America (CD 616, 1989).  It's a concert
with pieces such as Harlem Air Shaft, Theme Trambene, and Harlem Suite
(but not Such Sweet Thunder).   It's excellent.

Randall Martin

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editor assumes no responsibility for them.

Greenblatt Discussion Forum

The Shakespeare Conference: SHK 16.0229  Thursday, 3 February 2005

[Editor's Note: This thread appears to me to be reaching its useful
conclusion. Would contributors please make final statements before I
close it.]

[1]     From:   M Yawney <This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.>
        Date:   Wednesday, 2 Feb 2005 11:45:43 -0800 (PST)
        Subj:   Re: SHK 16.0218 Greenblatt Discussion Forum

[2]     From:   Peter Bridgman <This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.>
        Date:   Thursday, 3 Feb 2005 08:23:06 -0000
        Subj:   Re: SHK 16.0218 Greenblatt Discussion Forum

[3]     From:   Julia Crockett <This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.>
        Date:   Thursday, 3 Feb 2005 11:58:41 -0000
        Subj:   Re: SHK 16.0185 Greenblatt Discussion Forum


[1]-----------------------------------------------------------------
From:           M Yawney <This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.>
Date:           Wednesday, 2 Feb 2005 11:45:43 -0800 (PST)
Subject: 16.0218 Greenblatt Discussion Forum
Comment:        Re: SHK 16.0218 Greenblatt Discussion Forum

I am somewhat confused why Mr. Basch keeps referring to Shakespeare's
attraction to the lord as non-normal and unwholesome.

I think that most people who interpret the attraction erotically posit
it is as a normal and wholesome homosexual attraction. While I have
heard some attribute a dark sexuality to Shakespeare's involvement with
the dark lady, there is little, even in the most extreme interpretation
of the sonnets addressed to the young man, to suggest anything perverse
in this possible sexual attraction.

Mr. Basch gives no examples to support his assertion of something dark
in a more direct reading of the sonnets. Furthermore, if there is
something not-normal and unwholesome in the these sonnets when seen as
describing the poets relationship with a man, would not the some
non-normality and unwholesomeness still be there if we see the sonnets
as an allegory of poet's relationship with god? Mr. Basch does not
indicate that he sees the poems as describing such a disturbing
relationship with the divine, but surely the same content would be there
whomever the sonnets were addressed to.

Mr. Basch's perception of the relationship between Shakespeare and the
(human) lord strikes me as particularly odd since the Shakespeare that
Mr. Basch puts forward, one who encloses cryptic messages and embedded
clues in his writing, strikes me as a fairly unwholesome figure. At the
very least he is a more unwholesome Shakespeare than one who is writing
about the vagaries and turns of ordinary human relationships.

[2]-------------------------------------------------------------
From:           Peter Bridgman <This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.>
Date:           Thursday, 3 Feb 2005 08:23:06 -0000
Subject: 16.0218 Greenblatt Discussion Forum
Comment:        Re: SHK 16.0218 Greenblatt Discussion Forum

David Basch writes ...

 >Now read the letters from right to left from the letter "y" of the first
 >word "Why" in line 1 to pick up "yHV" and then read down to pick up a
 >second "h" in "Why" of the third line straddled by the pair of "V"s
 >above. This now reads "yHVh"-the Tetragramaton itself.

Fascinating.  However, in the versions of the bible available to WS -
the Bishops and Geneva bibles - the tetragramaton was written 'Iehouah'.

Peter Bridgman

[3]-------------------------------------------------------------
From:           Julia Crockett <This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.>
Date:           Thursday, 3 Feb 2005 11:58:41 -0000
Subject: 16.0185 Greenblatt Discussion Forum
Comment:        Re: SHK 16.0185 Greenblatt Discussion Forum

Alastair Fowler reviews Will in the World in Times Literary Supplement,
4 February 2005 No5314. The piece highlights the fictive/factual,
speculative/historical boundaries of Greenblatt's peculiar brand of
creative scholarship, concluding rather impatiently, "How did the
intelligent Greenblatt come to write so sloppy a book?"

Cheers,
Julia

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DISCLAIMER: Although SHAKSPER is a moderated discussion list, the
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Theatrical Patronage in Early Modern Europe

The Shakespeare Conference: SHK 16.0230  Friday, 4 February 2005

From:           Kevin De Ornellas <This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.>
Date:           Thursday, 03 Feb 2005 17:33:03 +0000
Subject:        Theatrical Patronage in Early Modern Europe

Theatrical Patronage in Early Modern Europe

Keele University
10-11 September 2005

"Where should a poet nowe a Patron finde,
To please his own, and please his Patrons minde?"

This is a call for papers on any topic relating to theatrical patronage
in Early Modern Europe.  The conference will draw together scholars
working on patrons and patronage networks in the British Isles and
mainland Europe; it will also extend the focus of patronage studies
beyond royalty and the nobility to consider gentry and civic patronage.
   We are especially keen to investigate the dynamic between patrons and
the theatre as it affects not only canonical dramatists, but also
actors, singers, female performers and children.

We would be particularly interested in papers engaging with any of the
following areas:

Patronage and the circulation of dramatic texts (including dedicatory
verses)
Kinship relations and patronage networks
Non-elite and non-metropolitan patronage
Patronage by and of women and children
Theatrical representations of patronage
Patronage of commercial and amateur performance

Please send abstracts (250 words) to Karen Britland
(k.r.britland_at_engl.keele.ac.uk) or Lucy Munro
(l.munro_at_engl.keele.ac.uk), or to School of English, Keele
University, Staffordshire, ST5 5BG, by 30 April 2005.

_______________________________________________________________
S H A K S P E R: The Global Shakespeare Discussion List
Hardy M. Cook, This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.
The S H A K S P E R Web Site <http://www.shaksper.net>

DISCLAIMER: Although SHAKSPER is a moderated discussion list, the
opinions expressed on it are the sole property of the poster, and the
editor assumes no responsibility for them.

Al Pacino in "Merchant of Venice"

The Shakespeare Conference: SHK 16.0228  Thursday, 3 February 2005

From:           Harvey Roy Greenberg This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.
Date:           Wednesday, 2 Feb 2005 15:24:56 EST
Subject: 16.0217 Al Pacino in "Merchant of Venice"
Comment:        Re: SHK 16.0217 Al Pacino in "Merchant of Venice"

Quite an artful reading by Professor Amit, but the play has suffered in
this century by twisting Shylock into a 'good' character. He is indeed
fully fleshed because that is what Shakespeare does with his most
interesting character, but in no way does this mean that Shakespeare is
offering the kind of complex apologia to the Jews this reader reads. I
saw a production at the Globe about ten years back in which Shylock was
detestably presented as a Sturmer archetype, and yet in a bizarre
fashion this vile MOV made more sense than these pro-semitic readings.

Ironically, I still remember that there was a very large photo of Sam
Wanamaker in the adjacent building, who was a mover and shaker in
resurrecting the Globe.

Vus machts a yid?

Harvey Roy Greenberg MD

_______________________________________________________________
S H A K S P E R: The Global Shakespeare Discussion List
Hardy M. Cook, This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.
The S H A K S P E R Web Site <http://www.shaksper.net>

DISCLAIMER: Although SHAKSPER is a moderated discussion list, the
opinions expressed on it are the sole property of the poster, and the
editor assumes no responsibility for them.

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