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Home :: Archive :: 2010 :: July ::
Hamlet's Feminine Endings
The Shakespeare Conference: SHK 21.0300  Tuesday, 20 July 2010

[1]  From:      John W Kennedy <
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     Date:      July 15, 2010 10:46:34 PM EDT
     Subj:      Re: SHK 21.0290  Hamlet's Feminine Endings
 
[2]  From:      Terence Hawkes <
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     Date:      Friday, July 16, 2010 6:55 AM
     Subj:      Re: SHK 21.0282  Hamlet's Feminine Endings
 
[3]  From:      Larry Weiss<
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     Date:      July 16, 2010 11:36:48 AM EDT
     Subj:      Re: SHK 21.0290  Hamlet's Feminine Endings
 

[1]-----------------------------------------------------------------
From:         John W Kennedy <
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Date:         July 15, 2010 10:46:34 PM EDT
Subject: 21.0290  Hamlet's Feminine Endings
Comment:      Re: SHK 21.0290  Hamlet's Feminine Endings

From: Paul Barry 
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>MacMorris, Jamy, and Fluellen speak in accents, not dialects; 
>their first language is Gaelic.

I rather fancy Jamy is speaking Scots Inglis, which was already well on the 
way to displacing Scots Gaelic by Henry V's time, let alone Shakespeare's. 
(James I of Scotland wrote his great poem in Inglis, after all.)

But MacMorris and Fluellen are certainly not English-speaking by birth, 
though Fluellen's native language Welsh, however Celtic, is not strictly 
Gaelic.

From: S. L Kasten <
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>Being something of a pedant myself I never considered Fluellen 
>a comic character; perhaps I was overly influenced by the film 
>"How Green Was My Valley". While his classical references might 
>seem quaint I don't find them far off the mark, no Dogberry he. 
>His accent did not hide a serious attitude to his military work, 
>an attitude perhaps as quirky as the proverbial English stiff 
>upper lip. As for the imitative speech, if the author wanted 
>to give special expression to the integrity and loyalty of 
>members of absorbed subject nations I can't think of any other 
>way to do so than by giving the characters something like their 
>natural voice. Surely Henry included them when he spoke to his 
>"band of brothers"; they were, after all, officers, a step in 
>rank above the soldiers Williams and Bates. On reflection one 
>gets the impression that the author considered Henry's charisma 
>a cement to the Union in a way that wasn't always there and 
>wasn't always to be there.

As for the Henry of the play on Fluellen:

Though it appears a little out of fashion
There is much care and valour in this Welshman.
(Another pair of feminine ended lines)

And fellow captain Gower to Pistol after the latter's drubbing at the hands 
of Fluellen:

...You thought because he could not speak English in the native garb, he 
could not therefore handle an English cudgel: you find it otherwise; and 
henceforth let a Welsh correction teach you a good English condition. Fare 
ye well.

All good points -- yet I cannot see anything but comedy in the salmons.


[2]-------------------------------------------------------------
From:         Terence Hawkes <
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Date:         Friday, July 16, 2010 6:55 AM
Subject: 21.0282  Hamlet's Feminine Endings
Comment:      Re: SHK 21.0282  Hamlet's Feminine Endings

Like it or not, Henry Vth was Welsh (Hv 4, 7, 104).
 
Terence Hawkes


[3]-------------------------------------------------------------
From:         Larry Weiss<
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Date:         July 16, 2010 11:36:48 AM EDT
Subject: 21.0290  Hamlet's Feminine Endings
Comment:      Re: SHK 21.0290  Hamlet's Feminine Endings

>Actually, I was thinking of exotic characters like Morocco, Arragon 
>in MOV or Rosencrantz and Guildenstern in Hamlet.

What makes R & G "exotic"; they are Danish gentlemen at the Danish court. 

Their names actually belong to well-known Danish families.


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